Thursday, 30 June 2016
IS candida the new epidemic - The Daily Mail online
Is candida the new epidemic?
by NAOMI COLEMAN, femail.co.uk
Most people associate candida with thrush or an itchy rash.
But according to alternative experts, a growing number of women are being diagnosed with candida - a condition where sufferers complain of a variety of symptoms including constant tiredness, a bloated stomach and aching joints.
However, if you visit your GP with the same complaints, the chances are your doctor won't recognise your symptoms as candida.
So why is candida such a controversial condition and why is medical opinion so torn about how it manifests itself?
To find out the truth behind candida, femail.co.uk has investigated this hotly debated condition and finds out whether you are at risk. Here, we look at the alternative approach to treating candida. Click at the bottom of the page to read the conventional medical view and an expert's conclusion
CANDIDA: THE ALTERNATIVE VIEW
According to alternative practitioners one in three women suffer from candida albicans - a yeast overgrowth that can occur in our body. Alternative experts claim candida can live in our intestines and other parts of our body such as the skin and mucous membranes.
One theory currently being put forward is that candida is a symptom of an endocrine disorder - where there is an imbalance between oestrogen and progesterone in the body.
This happens when the activity of oestrogen receptors is altered by contraceptive drugs or mercury poisoning from fillings, claim practitioners. Even if candida doesn't result from this directly, once these conditions are established in the body it only needs something small - such as a course of antibiotics - to unbalance the body and trigger yeast overgrowth, they say.
It is believed that most of the time yeast is kept in check by 'friendly' bacteria which live alongside it in the gut. If this balance between yeast and bacteria is out of kilter, for instance by antibiotics which kill off the bacteria, or in periods of low immunity following virus or stress, candida can start to grow and spread out of control.
Once there is overgrowth in the gut, say practitioners, candida can leak through the intestine wall and enter the bloodstream leading to a variety of symptoms including abdominal bloating, fatigue, muscular aches, food allergies and migraines which can underlie conditions such as chronic fatigue syndrome, irritable bowel syndrome and sinusitus.
The alternative treatments:
If you visit a homeopath or naturopath about your condition, you may be offered a specific diet where you reduce - or cut out - yeast such as bread, soya sauce and alcohol from your diet.
The idea is to starve the candida of yeast, which in turn, halts its growth and kills it off. You may also be given herbs such as aloe vera and acidophilus to encourage friendly bacteria to grow in your gut. This is claimed to help create a balance of good and bad bacteria in your body.
Click on the link below to read about the conventional view of candida and an expert's verdict
But according to alternative experts, a growing number of women are being diagnosed with candida - a condition where sufferers complain of a variety of symptoms including constant tiredness, a bloated stomach and aching joints.
However, if you visit your GP with the same complaints, the chances are your doctor won't recognise your symptoms as candida.
So why is candida such a controversial condition and why is medical opinion so torn about how it manifests itself?
To find out the truth behind candida, femail.co.uk has investigated this hotly debated condition and finds out whether you are at risk. Here, we look at the alternative approach to treating candida. Click at the bottom of the page to read the conventional medical view and an expert's conclusion
CANDIDA: THE ALTERNATIVE VIEW
According to alternative practitioners one in three women suffer from candida albicans - a yeast overgrowth that can occur in our body. Alternative experts claim candida can live in our intestines and other parts of our body such as the skin and mucous membranes.
One theory currently being put forward is that candida is a symptom of an endocrine disorder - where there is an imbalance between oestrogen and progesterone in the body.
This happens when the activity of oestrogen receptors is altered by contraceptive drugs or mercury poisoning from fillings, claim practitioners. Even if candida doesn't result from this directly, once these conditions are established in the body it only needs something small - such as a course of antibiotics - to unbalance the body and trigger yeast overgrowth, they say.
It is believed that most of the time yeast is kept in check by 'friendly' bacteria which live alongside it in the gut. If this balance between yeast and bacteria is out of kilter, for instance by antibiotics which kill off the bacteria, or in periods of low immunity following virus or stress, candida can start to grow and spread out of control.
Once there is overgrowth in the gut, say practitioners, candida can leak through the intestine wall and enter the bloodstream leading to a variety of symptoms including abdominal bloating, fatigue, muscular aches, food allergies and migraines which can underlie conditions such as chronic fatigue syndrome, irritable bowel syndrome and sinusitus.
The alternative treatments:
The idea is to starve the candida of yeast, which in turn, halts its growth and kills it off. You may also be given herbs such as aloe vera and acidophilus to encourage friendly bacteria to grow in your gut. This is claimed to help create a balance of good and bad bacteria in your body.
Click on the link below to read about the conventional view of candida and an expert's verdict
The MS Society should be disbanded, as "ms" does NOT exist
Perhaps someone should tell Wikipedia, now that's an idea, eh! shhhhhh! the walls have ears
Goodtotalk that was me, they didn't like me, I was got rid of by MS Society and a group that wouldn't let others listen and make a choice
07 Jun 2012 at 7:50 pm #1
Goodtotalk, you are technically right to say that Tiger's doctors could be wrong, in the same way that my doctors might have been wrong all these years and I do not actually have MS either, despite all the hard factual evidence to the contrary.
But I think it is a little ambitious on your part (to put it charitably) to suggest - as I think you do - that Tiger's problem is quite possibly caused by some vaguely-defined 'syndrome' that you happen to have a bee in your bonnet about. I think newly diagnosed people have enough to deal with without this kind of nonsense, quite frankly.
Alison
[/quote]
Goodtotalk, you are technically right to say that Tiger's doctors could be wrong, in the same way that my doctors might have been wrong all these years and I do not actually have MS either, despite all the hard factual evidence to the contrary.
But I think it is a little ambitious on your part (to put it charitably) to suggest - as I think you do - that Tiger's problem is quite possibly caused by some vaguely-defined 'syndrome' that you happen to have a bee in your bonnet about. I think newly diagnosed people have enough to deal with without this kind of nonsense, quite frankly.
Alison
[/quote]
Well said Alison! Goodtotalk also seems to have a misaligned atlas (?!), but not ms/possible ms from what I can gather, so probably isn't best placed to be offering support or advice on this forum? Candida can cause a range of symptoms, but none mimicking ms as far as I'm aware.
Fee,
You have stated repeatedly that you don't have MS and you have been banned from here on several occasions for sharing your usually downright daft theories.
Don't you think newbies have enough to deal with?
Please go away.
Fee,
I don't understand why you are here spouting off about candida and misaligned atlas joints again? You have categorically stated in several forums (including this one) that you do NOT have MS amd even that you don't even believe MS exists as a disease. Please stop confusing the issue for genuine MSers and people going through the diagnostic process who come here seeking information with your own home grown half baked theories.
Or as Anu put it, "Please go away"
LittleTiger, so sorry your post has got hijacked buy this nonsense but your question is perfectly valid and enough to do anyones head in. Vit B12 deficiency is definitely one of the "mimicers" that is looked for in the diagnostic stage as the symptoms can be very similar to MS. But if your MS was diagnosed from the results of an MRI and a Lumbar Puncture I would say that you do have MS (sorry) and also have Vit B12 deficiency as well. Sorry again :-( B12 will cause similar symptoms but it won't cause the changes found on MRI and LP that are characteristic of MS.
I have had MS for 9 years now and I still find myself graspinf=g at starws hoping that the Drs may have got it wrong and I don't really have MS after all. Not sure what else it could be that woud cause all these symptoms and disability but my favourite fantasy is that I don'yt actually have these disabilities eiyher and miraculaously I will eap from my wheel chair because it was all a mistake.... Sadly I think the reality is that I have been taking another of my frequeent holidays in Egypyt; I just love that river De Nile..... And may be that is where you are going with the hope that the Vit B12 deficiency cancels out the MS diagnosis.
hugs to you
Belinda
Could they have got it wrong?
Hey,
Wasnt sure which forum to post this on so decided this one.
Im just wondering whos had blood test for vit b12 thats comes back showing a deficiancy? and how common is it to have vit12 def and ms.
I was diagnosed with RRMS last year, supported by MRI and LP results, but would having a vit12 def have an effect on that? Hope thats making sense, I know what Im trying to say haha.
Ive managed to convince myself over the past week (im awaiting results for blood test) that I havent got ms after all!
Wasnt sure which forum to post this on so decided this one.
Im just wondering whos had blood test for vit b12 thats comes back showing a deficiancy? and how common is it to have vit12 def and ms.
I was diagnosed with RRMS last year, supported by MRI and LP results, but would having a vit12 def have an effect on that? Hope thats making sense, I know what Im trying to say haha.
Ive managed to convince myself over the past week (im awaiting results for blood test) that I havent got ms after all!
07 Jun 2012 at 7:58 pm
#2 
I'm B12-deficient and a lot of MSers seem to be. I get injections 3 monthly to top me up. Many of us find out we are B12-deficient because it is one of the easiest things to check out when someone is showing neuro problems (I can't honestly remember whether mine was checked before or after diagnosis - it was a long time ago.) My B12 levels must have been in the pink for about 10 years now on account of the injections. I've still go MS though, sad to say. Sorry.
Alison
x
Alison
x
08 Jun 2012 at 11:43 am
#3 
Hi, Vitamin B12 deficiency can certainly cause MS like symptoms, and it can, when extreme, cause nerve damage. It's diagnosed, as you know, by blood tests. It is not dx through MRI or LP and does not cause MS, so no, sorry to say, you still have MS although having the Vit B12 deficiency treated might help your symptoms.
From what I can tell by internet sites (so I am certainly not an expert!) it can cause pernicious anaemia (or perhaps is the same thing... doesn't seem clear) which is an auto immune condition, same as MS ... so it seems more likely that having MS may have caused the problem with Vit B12 than other way round.
I have been tested for Vit B12 and am ok. I think what happens is that when we get MS symptoms we are tested for loads of other stuff (inc vit B12 and vit D) and therefore some people are at that point found deficient... but of course if we didn't have MS symptoms we would never have been tested so it wouldn't have been found. Must be millions of people who are deficient but never have reason to be tested. Does that make sense?
Sorry to dash your hopes of not having MS... I think with MRI and LP results, and obviously your symptoms, you will have to accept that it is MS.
Anyway, google it. There's loads of info online.
Take care,
Pat x
From what I can tell by internet sites (so I am certainly not an expert!) it can cause pernicious anaemia (or perhaps is the same thing... doesn't seem clear) which is an auto immune condition, same as MS ... so it seems more likely that having MS may have caused the problem with Vit B12 than other way round.
I have been tested for Vit B12 and am ok. I think what happens is that when we get MS symptoms we are tested for loads of other stuff (inc vit B12 and vit D) and therefore some people are at that point found deficient... but of course if we didn't have MS symptoms we would never have been tested so it wouldn't have been found. Must be millions of people who are deficient but never have reason to be tested. Does that make sense?
Sorry to dash your hopes of not having MS... I think with MRI and LP results, and obviously your symptoms, you will have to accept that it is MS.
Anyway, google it. There's loads of info online.
Take care,
Pat x
08 Jun 2012 at 1:19 pm
#4
Anonymous
Tiger,
Yes they could have it wrong. There is a condition called Candida, I discovered I had it, over a year ago. when peolpe hear the word Candida the automatically think of vaginal thrush, but NO not this baby, it is considered to be the silent epidemic, as you wont know you have got it, I didnt. It causes a multitude of problems, vitamin deficiency is one of them, and many many others from allergies to joint pain, it can also be misdiagnosed as rheumatoid arthritus, its absolutely astounding, I have researched the subject extensively over the last 14months, it most certainly should be public knowledge, as can be brought on by stress, poor diet or antibiotic use, and thats why doctors deny it exists, and that is a massive mistake, it cannot be diagnosed by a blood test. It was discovered back in the 1980s and has gone unchecked since then, so in my opinion has been passed from mother to child, as it invades the blood, it is a fungus it is also called Candidiasis or Candida albicans. I believe mine was brought on by stress, wow did I suffer that big time and over many years, I was a worrier and the situation I found myself in contributed to the stress load (lack of money), it was a constant drip drip of stress and over many years
Candida needs to be public knowledge as can explain a lot.
Yes they could have it wrong. There is a condition called Candida, I discovered I had it, over a year ago. when peolpe hear the word Candida the automatically think of vaginal thrush, but NO not this baby, it is considered to be the silent epidemic, as you wont know you have got it, I didnt. It causes a multitude of problems, vitamin deficiency is one of them, and many many others from allergies to joint pain, it can also be misdiagnosed as rheumatoid arthritus, its absolutely astounding, I have researched the subject extensively over the last 14months, it most certainly should be public knowledge, as can be brought on by stress, poor diet or antibiotic use, and thats why doctors deny it exists, and that is a massive mistake, it cannot be diagnosed by a blood test. It was discovered back in the 1980s and has gone unchecked since then, so in my opinion has been passed from mother to child, as it invades the blood, it is a fungus it is also called Candidiasis or Candida albicans. I believe mine was brought on by stress, wow did I suffer that big time and over many years, I was a worrier and the situation I found myself in contributed to the stress load (lack of money), it was a constant drip drip of stress and over many years
Candida needs to be public knowledge as can explain a lot.
08 Jun 2012 at 2:55 pm
#5 goodtotalk wrote:
Yes they could have it wrong. There is a condition called Candida, I discovered I had it, over a year ago. when peolpe hear the word Candida the automatically think of vaginal thrush, but NO not this baby, it is considered to be the silent epidemic, as you wont know you have got it, I didnt. It causes a multitude of problems, vitamin deficiency is one of them, and many many others from allergies to joint pain, it can also be misdiagnosed as rheumatoid arthritus, its absolutely astounding, I have researched the subject extensively over the last 14months, it most certainly should be public knowledge, as can be brought on by stress, poor diet or antibiotic use, and thats why doctors deny it exists, and that is a massive mistake, it cannot be diagnosed by a blood test. It was discovered back in the 1980s and has gone unchecked since then, so in my opinion has been passed from mother to child, as it invades the blood, it is a fungus it is also called Candidiasis or Candida albicans. I believe mine was brought on by stress, wow did I suffer that big time and over many years, I was a worrier and the situation I found myself in contributed to the stress load (lack of money), it was a constant drip drip of stress and over many years
Candida needs to be public knowledge as can explain a lot.
Goodtotalk, you are technically right to say that Tiger's doctors could be wrong, in the same way that my doctors might have been wrong all these years and I do not actually have MS either, despite all the hard factual evidence to the contrary.
But I think it is a little ambitious on your part (to put it charitably) to suggest - as I think you do - that Tiger's problem is quite possibly caused by some vaguely-defined 'syndrome' that you happen to have a bee in your bonnet about. I think newly diagnosed people have enough to deal with without this kind of nonsense, quite frankly.
Alison
08 Jun 2012 at 4:11 pm
#6 [/quote]
Goodtotalk, you are technically right to say that Tiger's doctors could be wrong, in the same way that my doctors might have been wrong all these years and I do not actually have MS either, despite all the hard factual evidence to the contrary.
But I think it is a little ambitious on your part (to put it charitably) to suggest - as I think you do - that Tiger's problem is quite possibly caused by some vaguely-defined 'syndrome' that you happen to have a bee in your bonnet about. I think newly diagnosed people have enough to deal with without this kind of nonsense, quite frankly.
Alison
[/quote]
Well said Alison! Goodtotalk also seems to have a misaligned atlas (?!), but not ms/possible ms from what I can gather, so probably isn't best placed to be offering support or advice on this forum? Candida can cause a range of symptoms, but none mimicking ms as far as I'm aware.
08 Jun 2012 at 4:39 pm
#7 goodtotalk wrote:
Tiger,
Yes they could have it wrong. There is a condition called Candida, I discovered I had it, over a year ago. when peolpe hear the word Candida the automatically think of vaginal thrush, but NO not this baby, it is considered to be the silent epidemic, as you wont know you have got it, I didnt. It causes a multitude of problems, vitamin deficiency is one of them, and many many others from allergies to joint pain, it can also be misdiagnosed as rheumatoid arthritus, its absolutely astounding, I have researched the subject extensively over the last 14months, it most certainly should be public knowledge, as can be brought on by stress, poor diet or antibiotic use, and thats why doctors deny it exists, and that is a massive mistake, it cannot be diagnosed by a blood test. It was discovered back in the 1980s and has gone unchecked since then, so in my opinion has been passed from mother to child, as it invades the blood, it is a fungus it is also called Candidiasis or Candida albicans. I believe mine was brought on by stress, wow did I suffer that big time and over many years, I was a worrier and the situation I found myself in contributed to the stress load (lack of money), it was a constant drip drip of stress and over many years
Candida needs to be public knowledge as can explain a lot.
Fee,
You have stated repeatedly that you don't have MS and you have been banned from here on several occasions for sharing your usually downright daft theories.
Don't you think newbies have enough to deal with?
Please go away.
08 Jun 2012 at 5:43 pm
#8
Anonymous
Alison,
I'm not about forcing an opinion on someone, but to give them a choice or opportunity to at least consider it.
I get worried and I'm not talking about you, when others are a bit dictorial and manipulative in what others are allowed to read or consider for themselves.
If I treated my kids like that they would go mad, to presume that I didnt think they are capable of making a decission and I know best, they are 21 and 23. Even my youngest who's 14 knows more than I do on many subjects.
Candida can also cause brain fog, mood swings depression etc. etc.
I dont post info to get a reply, only if I ask a specific question. I post it as information, I have to limit the amount of time that I have to spend on this site, as I have other commitments, its only because I have the time these last couple of days.
What I have learnt over the years is that its not all about medical research only, alternative medicine is very relevant, I have a great respect for it, a great respect indeed.
Hark at me, I dont mean to get all heavy, I suppose what I am trying to say is, people can take it or leave
I'm not about forcing an opinion on someone, but to give them a choice or opportunity to at least consider it.
I get worried and I'm not talking about you, when others are a bit dictorial and manipulative in what others are allowed to read or consider for themselves.
If I treated my kids like that they would go mad, to presume that I didnt think they are capable of making a decission and I know best, they are 21 and 23. Even my youngest who's 14 knows more than I do on many subjects.
Candida can also cause brain fog, mood swings depression etc. etc.
I dont post info to get a reply, only if I ask a specific question. I post it as information, I have to limit the amount of time that I have to spend on this site, as I have other commitments, its only because I have the time these last couple of days.
What I have learnt over the years is that its not all about medical research only, alternative medicine is very relevant, I have a great respect for it, a great respect indeed.
Hark at me, I dont mean to get all heavy, I suppose what I am trying to say is, people can take it or leave
08 Jun 2012 at 5:45 pm
#9
Anonymous
.....or leave it. I meant to say, oooops pressed the wrong button
08 Jun 2012 at 7:59 pm
#10
LittleTiger it is awfully hard work coming to terms with an MS diagnosis (12 years in here, and it's work-in-progress.) But the start is the worst, no question, and you are in the thick of it - it is very early days. I am really sorry that this trouble has come to your door. As I suggested in an earlier post, no, I'm afraid the chances of it all having been a horrible mistake are vanishingly small. But it is the most natural thing in the world to cast around for something - anything - that might get you off the hook of an MS diagnosis. We've all been there. This is, I think, all part of the process of getting one's head around some very unwelcome news and slowly accepting it. I hope that you will always find on here that there are people who have been in a similar boat, and who can help you on your journey, as I have been helped so much over the years. Finding you have MS is bad news, no doubt about it, but it is possible to make a good life with MS. Really, it is. So hang on in there.
Alison
x
Alison
x
08 Jun 2012 at 11:19 pm
#11
Dear LittleTiger x
I was diagnosed last year and I am still in denial about it. I spent years convinced there was something wrong with me and then I got the diagnosis and felt so relieved. Now I wonder if maybe they made a mistake. I think its a common response to being diagnosed. Good Luck my lovely x I braved going to a local MS meeting the other day with people who are working aged MS and so met lots of people newly diagnosed like me. I would really recommend it.
I was diagnosed last year and I am still in denial about it. I spent years convinced there was something wrong with me and then I got the diagnosis and felt so relieved. Now I wonder if maybe they made a mistake. I think its a common response to being diagnosed. Good Luck my lovely x I braved going to a local MS meeting the other day with people who are working aged MS and so met lots of people newly diagnosed like me. I would really recommend it.
09 Jun 2012 at 12:33 am
#12 goodtotalk wrote:
Tiger,
Yes they could have it wrong. There is a condition called Candida, I discovered I had it, over a year ago. when peolpe hear the word Candida the automatically think of vaginal thrush, but NO not this baby, it is considered to be the silent epidemic, as you wont know you have got it, I didnt. It causes a multitude of problems, vitamin deficiency is one of them, and many many others from allergies to joint pain, it can also be misdiagnosed as rheumatoid arthritus, its absolutely astounding, I have researched the subject extensively over the last 14months, it most certainly should be public knowledge, as can be brought on by stress, poor diet or antibiotic use, and thats why doctors deny it exists, and that is a massive mistake, it cannot be diagnosed by a blood test. It was discovered back in the 1980s and has gone unchecked since then, so in my opinion has been passed from mother to child, as it invades the blood, it is a fungus it is also called Candidiasis or Candida albicans. I believe mine was brought on by stress, wow did I suffer that big time and over many years, I was a worrier and the situation I found myself in contributed to the stress load (lack of money), it was a constant drip drip of stress and over many years
Candida needs to be public knowledge as can explain a lot.
Fee,
I don't understand why you are here spouting off about candida and misaligned atlas joints again? You have categorically stated in several forums (including this one) that you do NOT have MS amd even that you don't even believe MS exists as a disease. Please stop confusing the issue for genuine MSers and people going through the diagnostic process who come here seeking information with your own home grown half baked theories.
Or as Anu put it, "Please go away"
LittleTiger, so sorry your post has got hijacked buy this nonsense but your question is perfectly valid and enough to do anyones head in. Vit B12 deficiency is definitely one of the "mimicers" that is looked for in the diagnostic stage as the symptoms can be very similar to MS. But if your MS was diagnosed from the results of an MRI and a Lumbar Puncture I would say that you do have MS (sorry) and also have Vit B12 deficiency as well. Sorry again :-( B12 will cause similar symptoms but it won't cause the changes found on MRI and LP that are characteristic of MS.
I have had MS for 9 years now and I still find myself graspinf=g at starws hoping that the Drs may have got it wrong and I don't really have MS after all. Not sure what else it could be that woud cause all these symptoms and disability but my favourite fantasy is that I don'yt actually have these disabilities eiyher and miraculaously I will eap from my wheel chair because it was all a mistake.... Sadly I think the reality is that I have been taking another of my frequeent holidays in Egypyt; I just love that river De Nile..... And may be that is where you are going with the hope that the Vit B12 deficiency cancels out the MS diagnosis.
hugs to you
Belinda
13 Jun 2012 at 12:22 pm
#13
Hi everyone,
Thanks so much for your responses, and sorry that I seem to of caused abit of trouble!
Ive been driving myself crazy over the past couple of weeks, and been pretty much attached to the internet looking things up :/
The other thing is, I've just changed neuros (had a few problems with the old one), and the new neuro has just done a new mri scan on me (didnt use contrast) and Im kinda of hoping he'll look at it and say I havent got ms? I asked if he wanted to do another LP and he said no as they got what they needed from that. So does anyone know why he would of done another mri scan?
Im going mad lol
Thanks again x
Thanks so much for your responses, and sorry that I seem to of caused abit of trouble!
Ive been driving myself crazy over the past couple of weeks, and been pretty much attached to the internet looking things up :/
The other thing is, I've just changed neuros (had a few problems with the old one), and the new neuro has just done a new mri scan on me (didnt use contrast) and Im kinda of hoping he'll look at it and say I havent got ms? I asked if he wanted to do another LP and he said no as they got what they needed from that. So does anyone know why he would of done another mri scan?
Im going mad lol
Thanks again x
13 Jun 2012 at 1:52 pm
#14
Hi LittleTiger,
As others have already said, it's unlikely that your new neuro will say the original diagnosis was wrong especially as it was supported by an mri and a positive lp as well as the symptoms that led you to see a neuro in the first place.
I would imagine that the reason that your new neuro has requested another mri is because you're his patient now. Some neuro's do order additional mri's further down the line too. I think the best thing to do really is to ask him to clarify things for you, but prepare yourself to be told that you do have ms.
The other thing I'd suggest is to try and steer away from googling too much. Sometimes it can cause no end of exra distress which you can well do without at the moment.
It can be just as hard being told and accepting that we have ms as it can be when we're in limboland not knowing what it is. The difference is that sometimes we hold onto that hope that the docs have got it wrong and we haven't got ms at all
Speak to your new neuro L.Tiger to put your mind at rest. Remember where we are if you need to chat
(((hugs)))
Debbie xx
As others have already said, it's unlikely that your new neuro will say the original diagnosis was wrong especially as it was supported by an mri and a positive lp as well as the symptoms that led you to see a neuro in the first place.
I would imagine that the reason that your new neuro has requested another mri is because you're his patient now. Some neuro's do order additional mri's further down the line too. I think the best thing to do really is to ask him to clarify things for you, but prepare yourself to be told that you do have ms.
The other thing I'd suggest is to try and steer away from googling too much. Sometimes it can cause no end of exra distress which you can well do without at the moment.
It can be just as hard being told and accepting that we have ms as it can be when we're in limboland not knowing what it is. The difference is that sometimes we hold onto that hope that the docs have got it wrong and we haven't got ms at all
Speak to your new neuro L.Tiger to put your mind at rest. Remember where we are if you need to chat
(((hugs)))
Debbie xx
Goodtotalk that was me, they didn't like me, I was got rid of by MS Society and a group that wouldn't let others listen and make a choice
07 Jun 2012 at 7:50 pm #1
Goodtotalk, you are technically right to say that Tiger's doctors could be wrong, in the same way that my doctors might have been wrong all these years and I do not actually have MS either, despite all the hard factual evidence to the contrary.
But I think it is a little ambitious on your part (to put it charitably) to suggest - as I think you do - that Tiger's problem is quite possibly caused by some vaguely-defined 'syndrome' that you happen to have a bee in your bonnet about. I think newly diagnosed people have enough to deal with without this kind of nonsense, quite frankly.
Alison
[/quote]
Goodtotalk, you are technically right to say that Tiger's doctors could be wrong, in the same way that my doctors might have been wrong all these years and I do not actually have MS either, despite all the hard factual evidence to the contrary.
But I think it is a little ambitious on your part (to put it charitably) to suggest - as I think you do - that Tiger's problem is quite possibly caused by some vaguely-defined 'syndrome' that you happen to have a bee in your bonnet about. I think newly diagnosed people have enough to deal with without this kind of nonsense, quite frankly.
Alison
[/quote]
Well said Alison! Goodtotalk also seems to have a misaligned atlas (?!), but not ms/possible ms from what I can gather, so probably isn't best placed to be offering support or advice on this forum? Candida can cause a range of symptoms, but none mimicking ms as far as I'm aware.
Fee,
You have stated repeatedly that you don't have MS and you have been banned from here on several occasions for sharing your usually downright daft theories.
Don't you think newbies have enough to deal with?
Please go away.
Fee,
I don't understand why you are here spouting off about candida and misaligned atlas joints again? You have categorically stated in several forums (including this one) that you do NOT have MS amd even that you don't even believe MS exists as a disease. Please stop confusing the issue for genuine MSers and people going through the diagnostic process who come here seeking information with your own home grown half baked theories.
Or as Anu put it, "Please go away"
LittleTiger, so sorry your post has got hijacked buy this nonsense but your question is perfectly valid and enough to do anyones head in. Vit B12 deficiency is definitely one of the "mimicers" that is looked for in the diagnostic stage as the symptoms can be very similar to MS. But if your MS was diagnosed from the results of an MRI and a Lumbar Puncture I would say that you do have MS (sorry) and also have Vit B12 deficiency as well. Sorry again :-( B12 will cause similar symptoms but it won't cause the changes found on MRI and LP that are characteristic of MS.
I have had MS for 9 years now and I still find myself graspinf=g at starws hoping that the Drs may have got it wrong and I don't really have MS after all. Not sure what else it could be that woud cause all these symptoms and disability but my favourite fantasy is that I don'yt actually have these disabilities eiyher and miraculaously I will eap from my wheel chair because it was all a mistake.... Sadly I think the reality is that I have been taking another of my frequeent holidays in Egypyt; I just love that river De Nile..... And may be that is where you are going with the hope that the Vit B12 deficiency cancels out the MS diagnosis.
hugs to you
Belinda
Could they have got it wrong?
Hey,
Wasnt sure which forum to post this on so decided this one.
Im just wondering whos had blood test for vit b12 thats comes back showing a deficiancy? and how common is it to have vit12 def and ms.
I was diagnosed with RRMS last year, supported by MRI and LP results, but would having a vit12 def have an effect on that? Hope thats making sense, I know what Im trying to say haha.
Ive managed to convince myself over the past week (im awaiting results for blood test) that I havent got ms after all!
Wasnt sure which forum to post this on so decided this one.
Im just wondering whos had blood test for vit b12 thats comes back showing a deficiancy? and how common is it to have vit12 def and ms.
I was diagnosed with RRMS last year, supported by MRI and LP results, but would having a vit12 def have an effect on that? Hope thats making sense, I know what Im trying to say haha.
Ive managed to convince myself over the past week (im awaiting results for blood test) that I havent got ms after all!
07 Jun 2012 at 7:58 pm
#2
I'm B12-deficient and a lot of MSers seem to be. I get injections 3 monthly to top me up. Many of us find out we are B12-deficient because it is one of the easiest things to check out when someone is showing neuro problems (I can't honestly remember whether mine was checked before or after diagnosis - it was a long time ago.) My B12 levels must have been in the pink for about 10 years now on account of the injections. I've still go MS though, sad to say. Sorry.
Alison
x
Alison
x
08 Jun 2012 at 11:43 am
#3
Hi, Vitamin B12 deficiency can certainly cause MS like symptoms, and it can, when extreme, cause nerve damage. It's diagnosed, as you know, by blood tests. It is not dx through MRI or LP and does not cause MS, so no, sorry to say, you still have MS although having the Vit B12 deficiency treated might help your symptoms.
From what I can tell by internet sites (so I am certainly not an expert!) it can cause pernicious anaemia (or perhaps is the same thing... doesn't seem clear) which is an auto immune condition, same as MS ... so it seems more likely that having MS may have caused the problem with Vit B12 than other way round.
I have been tested for Vit B12 and am ok. I think what happens is that when we get MS symptoms we are tested for loads of other stuff (inc vit B12 and vit D) and therefore some people are at that point found deficient... but of course if we didn't have MS symptoms we would never have been tested so it wouldn't have been found. Must be millions of people who are deficient but never have reason to be tested. Does that make sense?
Sorry to dash your hopes of not having MS... I think with MRI and LP results, and obviously your symptoms, you will have to accept that it is MS.
Anyway, google it. There's loads of info online.
Take care,
Pat x
From what I can tell by internet sites (so I am certainly not an expert!) it can cause pernicious anaemia (or perhaps is the same thing... doesn't seem clear) which is an auto immune condition, same as MS ... so it seems more likely that having MS may have caused the problem with Vit B12 than other way round.
I have been tested for Vit B12 and am ok. I think what happens is that when we get MS symptoms we are tested for loads of other stuff (inc vit B12 and vit D) and therefore some people are at that point found deficient... but of course if we didn't have MS symptoms we would never have been tested so it wouldn't have been found. Must be millions of people who are deficient but never have reason to be tested. Does that make sense?
Sorry to dash your hopes of not having MS... I think with MRI and LP results, and obviously your symptoms, you will have to accept that it is MS.
Anyway, google it. There's loads of info online.
Take care,
Pat x
08 Jun 2012 at 1:19 pm
#4
Anonymous
Tiger,
Yes they could have it wrong. There is a condition called Candida, I discovered I had it, over a year ago. when peolpe hear the word Candida the automatically think of vaginal thrush, but NO not this baby, it is considered to be the silent epidemic, as you wont know you have got it, I didnt. It causes a multitude of problems, vitamin deficiency is one of them, and many many others from allergies to joint pain, it can also be misdiagnosed as rheumatoid arthritus, its absolutely astounding, I have researched the subject extensively over the last 14months, it most certainly should be public knowledge, as can be brought on by stress, poor diet or antibiotic use, and thats why doctors deny it exists, and that is a massive mistake, it cannot be diagnosed by a blood test. It was discovered back in the 1980s and has gone unchecked since then, so in my opinion has been passed from mother to child, as it invades the blood, it is a fungus it is also called Candidiasis or Candida albicans. I believe mine was brought on by stress, wow did I suffer that big time and over many years, I was a worrier and the situation I found myself in contributed to the stress load (lack of money), it was a constant drip drip of stress and over many years
Candida needs to be public knowledge as can explain a lot.
Yes they could have it wrong. There is a condition called Candida, I discovered I had it, over a year ago. when peolpe hear the word Candida the automatically think of vaginal thrush, but NO not this baby, it is considered to be the silent epidemic, as you wont know you have got it, I didnt. It causes a multitude of problems, vitamin deficiency is one of them, and many many others from allergies to joint pain, it can also be misdiagnosed as rheumatoid arthritus, its absolutely astounding, I have researched the subject extensively over the last 14months, it most certainly should be public knowledge, as can be brought on by stress, poor diet or antibiotic use, and thats why doctors deny it exists, and that is a massive mistake, it cannot be diagnosed by a blood test. It was discovered back in the 1980s and has gone unchecked since then, so in my opinion has been passed from mother to child, as it invades the blood, it is a fungus it is also called Candidiasis or Candida albicans. I believe mine was brought on by stress, wow did I suffer that big time and over many years, I was a worrier and the situation I found myself in contributed to the stress load (lack of money), it was a constant drip drip of stress and over many years
Candida needs to be public knowledge as can explain a lot.
08 Jun 2012 at 2:55 pm
#5 goodtotalk wrote:
Yes they could have it wrong. There is a condition called Candida, I discovered I had it, over a year ago. when peolpe hear the word Candida the automatically think of vaginal thrush, but NO not this baby, it is considered to be the silent epidemic, as you wont know you have got it, I didnt. It causes a multitude of problems, vitamin deficiency is one of them, and many many others from allergies to joint pain, it can also be misdiagnosed as rheumatoid arthritus, its absolutely astounding, I have researched the subject extensively over the last 14months, it most certainly should be public knowledge, as can be brought on by stress, poor diet or antibiotic use, and thats why doctors deny it exists, and that is a massive mistake, it cannot be diagnosed by a blood test. It was discovered back in the 1980s and has gone unchecked since then, so in my opinion has been passed from mother to child, as it invades the blood, it is a fungus it is also called Candidiasis or Candida albicans. I believe mine was brought on by stress, wow did I suffer that big time and over many years, I was a worrier and the situation I found myself in contributed to the stress load (lack of money), it was a constant drip drip of stress and over many years
Candida needs to be public knowledge as can explain a lot.
Goodtotalk, you are technically right to say that Tiger's doctors could be wrong, in the same way that my doctors might have been wrong all these years and I do not actually have MS either, despite all the hard factual evidence to the contrary.
But I think it is a little ambitious on your part (to put it charitably) to suggest - as I think you do - that Tiger's problem is quite possibly caused by some vaguely-defined 'syndrome' that you happen to have a bee in your bonnet about. I think newly diagnosed people have enough to deal with without this kind of nonsense, quite frankly.
Alison
08 Jun 2012 at 4:11 pm
#6 [/quote]
Goodtotalk, you are technically right to say that Tiger's doctors could be wrong, in the same way that my doctors might have been wrong all these years and I do not actually have MS either, despite all the hard factual evidence to the contrary.
But I think it is a little ambitious on your part (to put it charitably) to suggest - as I think you do - that Tiger's problem is quite possibly caused by some vaguely-defined 'syndrome' that you happen to have a bee in your bonnet about. I think newly diagnosed people have enough to deal with without this kind of nonsense, quite frankly.
Alison
[/quote]
Well said Alison! Goodtotalk also seems to have a misaligned atlas (?!), but not ms/possible ms from what I can gather, so probably isn't best placed to be offering support or advice on this forum? Candida can cause a range of symptoms, but none mimicking ms as far as I'm aware.
08 Jun 2012 at 4:39 pm
#7 goodtotalk wrote:
Tiger,
Yes they could have it wrong. There is a condition called Candida, I discovered I had it, over a year ago. when peolpe hear the word Candida the automatically think of vaginal thrush, but NO not this baby, it is considered to be the silent epidemic, as you wont know you have got it, I didnt. It causes a multitude of problems, vitamin deficiency is one of them, and many many others from allergies to joint pain, it can also be misdiagnosed as rheumatoid arthritus, its absolutely astounding, I have researched the subject extensively over the last 14months, it most certainly should be public knowledge, as can be brought on by stress, poor diet or antibiotic use, and thats why doctors deny it exists, and that is a massive mistake, it cannot be diagnosed by a blood test. It was discovered back in the 1980s and has gone unchecked since then, so in my opinion has been passed from mother to child, as it invades the blood, it is a fungus it is also called Candidiasis or Candida albicans. I believe mine was brought on by stress, wow did I suffer that big time and over many years, I was a worrier and the situation I found myself in contributed to the stress load (lack of money), it was a constant drip drip of stress and over many years
Candida needs to be public knowledge as can explain a lot.
Fee,
You have stated repeatedly that you don't have MS and you have been banned from here on several occasions for sharing your usually downright daft theories.
Don't you think newbies have enough to deal with?
Please go away.
08 Jun 2012 at 5:43 pm
#8
Anonymous
Alison,
I'm not about forcing an opinion on someone, but to give them a choice or opportunity to at least consider it.
I get worried and I'm not talking about you, when others are a bit dictorial and manipulative in what others are allowed to read or consider for themselves.
If I treated my kids like that they would go mad, to presume that I didnt think they are capable of making a decission and I know best, they are 21 and 23. Even my youngest who's 14 knows more than I do on many subjects.
Candida can also cause brain fog, mood swings depression etc. etc.
I dont post info to get a reply, only if I ask a specific question. I post it as information, I have to limit the amount of time that I have to spend on this site, as I have other commitments, its only because I have the time these last couple of days.
What I have learnt over the years is that its not all about medical research only, alternative medicine is very relevant, I have a great respect for it, a great respect indeed.
Hark at me, I dont mean to get all heavy, I suppose what I am trying to say is, people can take it or leave
I'm not about forcing an opinion on someone, but to give them a choice or opportunity to at least consider it.
I get worried and I'm not talking about you, when others are a bit dictorial and manipulative in what others are allowed to read or consider for themselves.
If I treated my kids like that they would go mad, to presume that I didnt think they are capable of making a decission and I know best, they are 21 and 23. Even my youngest who's 14 knows more than I do on many subjects.
Candida can also cause brain fog, mood swings depression etc. etc.
I dont post info to get a reply, only if I ask a specific question. I post it as information, I have to limit the amount of time that I have to spend on this site, as I have other commitments, its only because I have the time these last couple of days.
What I have learnt over the years is that its not all about medical research only, alternative medicine is very relevant, I have a great respect for it, a great respect indeed.
Hark at me, I dont mean to get all heavy, I suppose what I am trying to say is, people can take it or leave
08 Jun 2012 at 5:45 pm
#9
Anonymous
.....or leave it. I meant to say, oooops pressed the wrong button
08 Jun 2012 at 7:59 pm
#10
LittleTiger it is awfully hard work coming to terms with an MS diagnosis (12 years in here, and it's work-in-progress.) But the start is the worst, no question, and you are in the thick of it - it is very early days. I am really sorry that this trouble has come to your door. As I suggested in an earlier post, no, I'm afraid the chances of it all having been a horrible mistake are vanishingly small. But it is the most natural thing in the world to cast around for something - anything - that might get you off the hook of an MS diagnosis. We've all been there. This is, I think, all part of the process of getting one's head around some very unwelcome news and slowly accepting it. I hope that you will always find on here that there are people who have been in a similar boat, and who can help you on your journey, as I have been helped so much over the years. Finding you have MS is bad news, no doubt about it, but it is possible to make a good life with MS. Really, it is. So hang on in there.
Alison
x
Alison
x
08 Jun 2012 at 11:19 pm
#11
Dear LittleTiger x
I was diagnosed last year and I am still in denial about it. I spent years convinced there was something wrong with me and then I got the diagnosis and felt so relieved. Now I wonder if maybe they made a mistake. I think its a common response to being diagnosed. Good Luck my lovely x I braved going to a local MS meeting the other day with people who are working aged MS and so met lots of people newly diagnosed like me. I would really recommend it.
I was diagnosed last year and I am still in denial about it. I spent years convinced there was something wrong with me and then I got the diagnosis and felt so relieved. Now I wonder if maybe they made a mistake. I think its a common response to being diagnosed. Good Luck my lovely x I braved going to a local MS meeting the other day with people who are working aged MS and so met lots of people newly diagnosed like me. I would really recommend it.
09 Jun 2012 at 12:33 am
#12 goodtotalk wrote:
Tiger,
Yes they could have it wrong. There is a condition called Candida, I discovered I had it, over a year ago. when peolpe hear the word Candida the automatically think of vaginal thrush, but NO not this baby, it is considered to be the silent epidemic, as you wont know you have got it, I didnt. It causes a multitude of problems, vitamin deficiency is one of them, and many many others from allergies to joint pain, it can also be misdiagnosed as rheumatoid arthritus, its absolutely astounding, I have researched the subject extensively over the last 14months, it most certainly should be public knowledge, as can be brought on by stress, poor diet or antibiotic use, and thats why doctors deny it exists, and that is a massive mistake, it cannot be diagnosed by a blood test. It was discovered back in the 1980s and has gone unchecked since then, so in my opinion has been passed from mother to child, as it invades the blood, it is a fungus it is also called Candidiasis or Candida albicans. I believe mine was brought on by stress, wow did I suffer that big time and over many years, I was a worrier and the situation I found myself in contributed to the stress load (lack of money), it was a constant drip drip of stress and over many years
Candida needs to be public knowledge as can explain a lot.
Fee,
I don't understand why you are here spouting off about candida and misaligned atlas joints again? You have categorically stated in several forums (including this one) that you do NOT have MS amd even that you don't even believe MS exists as a disease. Please stop confusing the issue for genuine MSers and people going through the diagnostic process who come here seeking information with your own home grown half baked theories.
Or as Anu put it, "Please go away"
LittleTiger, so sorry your post has got hijacked buy this nonsense but your question is perfectly valid and enough to do anyones head in. Vit B12 deficiency is definitely one of the "mimicers" that is looked for in the diagnostic stage as the symptoms can be very similar to MS. But if your MS was diagnosed from the results of an MRI and a Lumbar Puncture I would say that you do have MS (sorry) and also have Vit B12 deficiency as well. Sorry again :-( B12 will cause similar symptoms but it won't cause the changes found on MRI and LP that are characteristic of MS.
I have had MS for 9 years now and I still find myself graspinf=g at starws hoping that the Drs may have got it wrong and I don't really have MS after all. Not sure what else it could be that woud cause all these symptoms and disability but my favourite fantasy is that I don'yt actually have these disabilities eiyher and miraculaously I will eap from my wheel chair because it was all a mistake.... Sadly I think the reality is that I have been taking another of my frequeent holidays in Egypyt; I just love that river De Nile..... And may be that is where you are going with the hope that the Vit B12 deficiency cancels out the MS diagnosis.
hugs to you
Belinda
13 Jun 2012 at 12:22 pm
#13
Hi everyone,
Thanks so much for your responses, and sorry that I seem to of caused abit of trouble!
Ive been driving myself crazy over the past couple of weeks, and been pretty much attached to the internet looking things up :/
The other thing is, I've just changed neuros (had a few problems with the old one), and the new neuro has just done a new mri scan on me (didnt use contrast) and Im kinda of hoping he'll look at it and say I havent got ms? I asked if he wanted to do another LP and he said no as they got what they needed from that. So does anyone know why he would of done another mri scan?
Im going mad lol
Thanks again x
Thanks so much for your responses, and sorry that I seem to of caused abit of trouble!
Ive been driving myself crazy over the past couple of weeks, and been pretty much attached to the internet looking things up :/
The other thing is, I've just changed neuros (had a few problems with the old one), and the new neuro has just done a new mri scan on me (didnt use contrast) and Im kinda of hoping he'll look at it and say I havent got ms? I asked if he wanted to do another LP and he said no as they got what they needed from that. So does anyone know why he would of done another mri scan?
Im going mad lol
Thanks again x
13 Jun 2012 at 1:52 pm
#14
Hi LittleTiger,
As others have already said, it's unlikely that your new neuro will say the original diagnosis was wrong especially as it was supported by an mri and a positive lp as well as the symptoms that led you to see a neuro in the first place.
I would imagine that the reason that your new neuro has requested another mri is because you're his patient now. Some neuro's do order additional mri's further down the line too. I think the best thing to do really is to ask him to clarify things for you, but prepare yourself to be told that you do have ms.
The other thing I'd suggest is to try and steer away from googling too much. Sometimes it can cause no end of exra distress which you can well do without at the moment.
It can be just as hard being told and accepting that we have ms as it can be when we're in limboland not knowing what it is. The difference is that sometimes we hold onto that hope that the docs have got it wrong and we haven't got ms at all
Speak to your new neuro L.Tiger to put your mind at rest. Remember where we are if you need to chat
(((hugs)))
Debbie xx
As others have already said, it's unlikely that your new neuro will say the original diagnosis was wrong especially as it was supported by an mri and a positive lp as well as the symptoms that led you to see a neuro in the first place.
I would imagine that the reason that your new neuro has requested another mri is because you're his patient now. Some neuro's do order additional mri's further down the line too. I think the best thing to do really is to ask him to clarify things for you, but prepare yourself to be told that you do have ms.
The other thing I'd suggest is to try and steer away from googling too much. Sometimes it can cause no end of exra distress which you can well do without at the moment.
It can be just as hard being told and accepting that we have ms as it can be when we're in limboland not knowing what it is. The difference is that sometimes we hold onto that hope that the docs have got it wrong and we haven't got ms at all
Speak to your new neuro L.Tiger to put your mind at rest. Remember where we are if you need to chat
(((hugs)))
Debbie xx
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