Noel Batten??
by tzootsi » Mon Feb 01, 2010 5:59 pm
A year ago I looked at some material by Noel Batten on the web. Batten claims dramatic improvement for ms patients using a form of chiropractic, along with stress management. At the time, he seemed like just another charlatan selling his books on the web. However, with the CCSVI procedure looking very promising, some of his theories now don't seem so far out. Anyone have any experience or thoughts about Batten? He has a lot of new videos on the web.
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by gainsbourg » Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:52 am
Yes....well, many readers of the Forum will remember the infamous psychological thread which opened with me giving an account of Batten's psychological and circulation theories of MS - about 18 months ago. Due to my being a novice in forum etiquette, some people even thought I was Batten in disguise!
Like me, Battten is a strong believer that the mind (eg. as in "stress") is not only a factor in the development of MS but that the power of the mind can (and should) be harnessed in its treatment.
Doctors increasingly like to treat the mind and body as sepatate entities, but the truth is they form one complex continuum. Little surprise then, that many people with serious conditions like MS are offended when they hear theories of how the mind can affect the body - thinking that they are being blamed for creating or sustaining their own illness.
Sadly, quite a bit of "Batten bashing" followed - no one took him (or me) seriously. The fact that he is the author of several other eBooks "cures" for neurological illnesses not helping matters. He may be quirky and eccentric but his stuff is definitely worth reading.
He believes that muscular tension (caused by stress and other emotions) can cause long term "knots" and consequently poor blood flow, when occuring in tissues close to the brain and spine.
I hope you are right, and that the CCSVI findings will encourage people to take Batten a bit more seriously. My belief is that there is a connection between the workings of the mind, blood flow and MS but that it will turn out to be much more complicated than simply being caused by muscular tension.
gainsbourg
Like me, Battten is a strong believer that the mind (eg. as in "stress") is not only a factor in the development of MS but that the power of the mind can (and should) be harnessed in its treatment.
Doctors increasingly like to treat the mind and body as sepatate entities, but the truth is they form one complex continuum. Little surprise then, that many people with serious conditions like MS are offended when they hear theories of how the mind can affect the body - thinking that they are being blamed for creating or sustaining their own illness.
Sadly, quite a bit of "Batten bashing" followed - no one took him (or me) seriously. The fact that he is the author of several other eBooks "cures" for neurological illnesses not helping matters. He may be quirky and eccentric but his stuff is definitely worth reading.
He believes that muscular tension (caused by stress and other emotions) can cause long term "knots" and consequently poor blood flow, when occuring in tissues close to the brain and spine.
I hope you are right, and that the CCSVI findings will encourage people to take Batten a bit more seriously. My belief is that there is a connection between the workings of the mind, blood flow and MS but that it will turn out to be much more complicated than simply being caused by muscular tension.
gainsbourg
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Re: Noel Batten??
by Serena42 » Sat Sep 22, 2012 11:22 am
I've been looking at his videos and really would like to know if anyone here has tried his method or treatment. Please...no "he's a quack pot" posts about him or negatives, please. I'm keeping all my options open. Thanks.
Serena
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Re: Noel Batten??
by cheerleader » Sat Sep 22, 2012 1:33 pm Serena42 wrote:I've been looking at his videos and really would like to know if anyone here has tried his method or treatment. Please...no "he's a quack pot" posts about him or negatives, please. I'm keeping all my options open. Thanks.
Serena
Hi Serena---
My husband had a happy childhood, and is not an attention seeker or overly dramatic....but he did have a lot of work stress and wasn't really in touch with how that affected his health. Cortisol is really bad for pwMS, as are a lot of lifestyle issues that increase inflammation. I think it's good to be open, but I'd avoid spending too much money on psycho- therapies like Batten's, which tend to blame the sick person for not being healthy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DkvNu46l0RQ
The things Batten is right on about are deep breathing, releasing stress, aligning the neck and keeping curve in cervical spine. Also, correcting negative thought patterns.
Here were the strategies I put together for my husband, to help him find a life in balance---through nutrition, lifestyle, supplements, exercise, meditation. No need to buy an e-book. Or beat yourself up for having MS. Best to you, Serena, hope you find your answers.
http://www.ccsvi.org/index.php/helping- ... ial-health
cheer
Husband dx RRMS 3/07
dx dual jugular vein stenosis (CCSVI) 4/09
http://ccsviinms.blogspot.com
dx dual jugular vein stenosis (CCSVI) 4/09
http://ccsviinms.blogspot.com
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Re: Noel Batten??
by gainsbourg » Sun Nov 11, 2012 12:07 pm
Hi Serena,
One thing you have to hand to Batten was that his book encouraged MSrs to improve circulation to the brain or spine, by various means such as chiropractor and massage (this at a time when the role of the vascular system in MS was almost universally dismissed). His unorthodox views about the role of the vascular system seem to have been vindicated somewhat. That isn't to say he went as far as to claim that vascular problems cause MS.
What attracted me to Batten was not his 'vascular views'. it was that he was a big believer that stress in many forms was to be avoided in MS. Seeing as this thread has bounced up again, I'd like to say that as someone who downloaded and read Batten's book a few years back, I'm not sure if his book or videos are the best place to learn about ways we can best avoid and/or cope with stress but I believe it is of paramount importance. If any book, video, technique, course or whatever helps you cope better with stress - use it. It could well be as important as any medication.
Excess cortisol may be one reason to avoid stress but the stress/body connection just isn't that simple. The white matter, which becomes diseased in MS, is like a communication network between different parts of the brain, rather like a switchboard. When a switchboard gets "stressed" or strained it can go into meltdown - of course, that's just a metaphor, but maybe stress aggravates MS because it somehow affects the very tissue from which it originates. Presumably other factors need to co-incide with the stress (I've long said it is one of the various forms of herpes) but you should not overlook stress if you have MS. For example, if you have a very demanding or stressful occupation that you really don't cope with very well, I'd consider changing it, even if it brings about a big drop in your finances. It's very unlikely you'd hear that kind of advice from your doctor, because the medical profession usually dismiss the important role the mind can play in illness.
BTW, MS may exaserpate vascular problems in many with MS but I have never believed that CCSVI is causal of MS - it's probably just another symptom of the disease. How can it be causal, when every study (other than Zamboni's) has shown that CCSVI not only occurs in healthy people, but that it is as common as being left handed.
gainsbourg
One thing you have to hand to Batten was that his book encouraged MSrs to improve circulation to the brain or spine, by various means such as chiropractor and massage (this at a time when the role of the vascular system in MS was almost universally dismissed). His unorthodox views about the role of the vascular system seem to have been vindicated somewhat. That isn't to say he went as far as to claim that vascular problems cause MS.
What attracted me to Batten was not his 'vascular views'. it was that he was a big believer that stress in many forms was to be avoided in MS. Seeing as this thread has bounced up again, I'd like to say that as someone who downloaded and read Batten's book a few years back, I'm not sure if his book or videos are the best place to learn about ways we can best avoid and/or cope with stress but I believe it is of paramount importance. If any book, video, technique, course or whatever helps you cope better with stress - use it. It could well be as important as any medication.
Excess cortisol may be one reason to avoid stress but the stress/body connection just isn't that simple. The white matter, which becomes diseased in MS, is like a communication network between different parts of the brain, rather like a switchboard. When a switchboard gets "stressed" or strained it can go into meltdown - of course, that's just a metaphor, but maybe stress aggravates MS because it somehow affects the very tissue from which it originates. Presumably other factors need to co-incide with the stress (I've long said it is one of the various forms of herpes) but you should not overlook stress if you have MS. For example, if you have a very demanding or stressful occupation that you really don't cope with very well, I'd consider changing it, even if it brings about a big drop in your finances. It's very unlikely you'd hear that kind of advice from your doctor, because the medical profession usually dismiss the important role the mind can play in illness.
BTW, MS may exaserpate vascular problems in many with MS but I have never believed that CCSVI is causal of MS - it's probably just another symptom of the disease. How can it be causal, when every study (other than Zamboni's) has shown that CCSVI not only occurs in healthy people, but that it is as common as being left handed.
gainsbourg
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Re: Noel Batten??
by blossom » Sun Nov 11, 2012 2:53 pm
gainsbourg, believe it or not i had actually called noel batten quite a few yrs. ago. doubt he remembers. but i thought his way of thinking and treating made sence. yrs. later we have dr. flanagan here at tims and ccsvi and a lot of people putting their thinking caps on. also, it seems to me someone posted a thread about research and effects of stress on ms. this is all very complicated so shutting the door to ideas is not good. look how long mainstream has had most convinced that your only options for ms was to take immune suppressing drugs. --- and the drugs are still being peddled and people are just as sick as ever if not worse.
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